“It is unfortunate that character of government has not changed yet, if you will be sensitive to the issues then dialogue will automatically happen, the government is awake now but it is
So late and so little”
But think that if many leaders of Congress start thinking of “Rahul free Congress” then something can happen to the country’s oldest political party
Today it is all about PMO, it has everything in its hand and we all know that when Ganga was comprised in deadlock hair of Shiva a lot of prayers were made, similarly PMO has comprised Ganga in itself.
In today’s scenario I don’t think of Congress-free India, but think that if many leaders of Congress start thinking of “Rahul free Congress” then something can happen to the country’s oldest political party.
- Regularly you are traveling, Jaipur, Ayodhya, Varanasi. Where do you get such energy?
- Reason behind it that I have always been goal oriented since 1965 I am fighting for what I seek and will continue with the same pace till I achieve my goal. Why would I stop?
- Talking about Narendra Modi Government, I am highlighting Modi’s name because he is the only face of BJP, with which (BJP) is about to go for election for its next tenure; How do you see his governance?
- Two key points I would specifically raise here about Narendra ji, first is his Intention towards making India a great country around the globe and second is his efforts and extreme fatigue to fulfill his Intentions.
- On the one hand you praise Modi that he is the most workaholic prime minister post-independence and on the other hand you also criticize his policy such as Demonetization.
- I do say that not all decision taken by a government is correct, I already had told that if we have to see the right perspective of demonetization we have to wait up to 2 years, if you look at the first 15 days of demonetization it was extremely disturbing, if you analyze the next 6 months the money started coming back, but if we look in the third phase under 2 years then we reckon that nothing happened, if you wanted to digitize then it was not the way, and if you had to reduce the flow of your currency in foreign land then what was the necessity of bringing new notes. This decision is full of all oddity.
- What was the urgency to bring Demonetization without any analysis of its post effect?
- Actually it happens, like there is a package where you select only half of it, here with the inclusion of 2000 rupee notes which was not in the scheme, it automatically says that old notes will be made invalid, plenty of absurdity exist in this scheme.
- Speaking about Atal Ji he always believed in Devotion performing rather than Power performing, but Babri demolition happened was it like someone else was taking decision behind the curtain?
- No, I would like to elaborate it a bit, it was not like someone was taking decisions I would say it was neither intentional nor planned, I was in Chennai not in Ayodhya during demolition but what I believe as my wit is that there was a huge difference in the intensity of the intention of the Kar Sevaks and the people who were holding the stage. The Kar Sevaks moved towards structure and the arrangement which were organized for forbidding them appeared helpless and then those were in protection started demolishing.
So, what I believe is that the difference in the intensity of mass movement and cadre movement was misinterpreted by Cadres. Nobody from sangh was able to comprehend the movement.
- Amid if we try to comprehend, as per your statement Atal Ji was moderate, an incident also happened in which a report came which said that you called Atal Ji as a façade of BJP, as a result of which you had to leave the party.
- I only request to look into the timeline of the happening then only the fog will clear. 6 December 1992, you are quite correct, Atal ji was alarmed of people’s mood. He was not agreeing upon mobilization and Rathyatra also, he also had told to Kar Sevaks that watch out we are not heading towards Lanka we are going towards Ayodhya. We are going for devotion projection, not for power projection, he was a bit far-sighted. As far as Façade is concerned on 16th September 1997 I talked to the British high Commissioner about whom Bhanupratap Shukla wrote a column where he noted that Shri Govindacharya is quoting the chief of his own party Atal ji as façade, what will happen to the discipline of the party?
It was also said that there is a tape of the meeting, to which I got excited that this is the best defense for me; I asked Atal ji when I met him on 23rd October, ‘do you have any tape?’ He replied nodding his head and said there is nothing like that, you will continue to work, and hence the altercation ends on 23 Oct 1997. Elections happen in 1998 and Atal ji becomes prime minister and I remain as General Secretary of the party till 2000. I leave the office on the ground of studying the ill impact of globalization.
- A party which raises from Ram temple agitation, but when Ram temple has become a political tool now, and now BJP says that the matter is in Apex court we cannot interfere, what is the reason behind putting Ram temple issue in the manifesto, how do you see it?
- Without alleging the intentions I would say that this issue is of belief, it is of judiciary concern. Ownership can be claimed by Court but judgment cannot state that where the ram was born it is a matter of belief and faith.
- But the question remains the same; why a party does not keeps it in mind while drafting manifesto, is it not that party is misleading its voters?
- I had and I have always believed that the solution can only come by implementing the law, the court is handicapped here. I believe that Government should keep their promises or else public will ask.
- Do you see Ram temple issue as a Political agenda for 2019?
- I believe Ram can never be a political issue; Ram will always remain an issue of faith and belief.
- When we look at the caste and religion in this country, how can it be achieved by mutual consent because when we look at the data of resentment of 2014 and 2018 we find a vast increase?
- I believe that it can only be achieved by self-determination and by integrating all.
- So, you believe that Government lacks intention?
- No, I see a lack of determination.
- Recently, Supreme Court gave a decision on SC ST act which caused violence; ultimatum was up to August before Government to which government kneeled. This caused agitation by Upper caste for the first time in the history, isn’t the government provoking the Upper caste?
- It is unfortunate that character of government has not changed yet, if you will be sensitive to the issues then dialogue will automatically happen, the government is awake now but it is so late and so little, whether I say or not it is obvious to interpret. If a world-famous environmentalist GD Agarwal had died on a fast to save a river it is a shame for the government.
- On 2 October this year, on the eve of world non-violence day, we saw agitation by farmers and were beaten up by cops, was it not possible for the government to handle it in some other way?
- I believe it as an irresponsible behavior of Government, it was agreed that according to Swaminathan report MSP (Minimum selling price) will be fixed but ignoring this will certainly raise an agitation and the government will be blameworthy for that.
- Demand is one thing, may be reacting to demands is difficult for government in the real world but beating farmers! Is it justified?
- The government officials had given affidavits for increasing the MSP to double, in the manifesto of BJP it was also there, and then who is stopping the government to implement, in this regard I believe PMO should also take it into consideration.
- He emphasizes on Gandhi; he admires Gandhi symbolically but his work resembles Godse?
- Action only proves intentions; I don’t have any idea about Godse but still personally I say that his act was against humanity and against national interest and those who still praises Godse I cannot say anything about them.
- Modi only speaks on the issues which seem convenient to him not on what is necessary. Is this opportunism politics?
- You can say it as dexterous politics.
- How do you define dexterous politics?
- It is a perception that serving people is the motto of politics and the best way to serve people is politics, hence there will be aspects of it, to keep its aspects alive for the sake of people will not be considered as opportunism.
- But if we look at the duo of Amit Shah and Narendra Modi it appears that their only motto is of Congress-free India and in pursuit of that whatever mishap happens they are not accountable of?
- If you call a huge party like BJP as of only two person’s party, I think it will be an injustice to those lakhs of people, who had been and are contributing themselves in any way.
- BJP calls itself as Party with difference but it appears that those who are culpable in any other party are purifying themselves by bathing in BJP’s water, why is that?
- I cannot say anything about that; I am the same audience as you are. There was a time during 1997 when the documents were drafted for the correct functioning of the party but I believe that it was never followed.
And if winning becomes sole motto then right and wrong becomes incomparable. So, in this scenario, it becomes necessary for people to wake and take a call because in a democracy it is the people’s vote which decides the fate of a party.
- If BJP comes in power again in 2019 then will it be an option less win?
- Win is win howsoever it comes, whatever you analyze about it is a win.
- How do you see it?
- In today’s scenario I don’t think of Congress-free India, but think that if many leaders of Congress start thinking of “Rahul free Congress” then something can happen to the country’s oldest political party.
- Means you agree that today’s politics has become option less.
- What I believe is that in today’s scenario we see that there is no opposition; they cannot blame others for it.
- If we hear to RSS Chief Mohan Bhagwat’s speeches these days, do you find any ideological difference in BJP and RSS?
- I don’t see any ideological difference. There was one thing that was said that without Muslim, Hindutva doesn’t exist, but you didn’t understand it correctly that does it meant that when there was no Muslim, was it not a Hindu Nation? It was; for Hindutva it is not necessary to have Muslims but it is necessary to understand that if Muslims exist, than what?
- Usually PM Modi uses Mann Ki Baat, but we have seen Nitin Gadkari talking about his Mann Ki Baat, Gadkari said that they (BJP) never thought that they will regain power so they started making limitless promises. How do you see this statement?
- This kind of statements diminishes you own political weight, if you take your statements so lightly then you are betraying the people who voted you to power.
So I urge each and every party not to act in such a childish and irresponsible behavior because in politics it is the people who will be deciding your fate again.
- A heart touching movement was started by PM Modi that was Namami Gange Project, but when we see about it now after 4 and half year we find it heartbreaking, who do you think are culprits?
- I believe the government is responsible for it because they didn’t show the basic wit that if Ganga is talked it is all about her purity, and if you talk about purity it is all about inseparability and velocity of her flow.
For the first time in four and half years’ government spoke about it, this means these years gone in vain.
- Do you think that Uma Bharti became a “Sacrificial Goat”?
- Today it is all about PMO, it has everything in its hand and we all know that when Ganga was comprised in deadlock hair of Shiva a lot of prayers were made, similarly PMO has comprised Ganga in itself. I believe the opposition will also support the same today as Advani ji supported UPA when he was in opposition, but firstly it is ruling party’s duty to take Ganga out of state project to the concurrent list of Center.
- What do you see here, lack of maturity, lack of intention or lack of determination?
- First of all, Ganga is all about faith and belief, you have to think differently about Ganga and Ram issue. First, we need to think that we need Ganga Ji and the rest should be considered accordingly.
If you want an ecological zone of 125 km and will also stop Ganga’s flow by blocking them by installing turbines in between, how is this possible? Who will believe you?
Ganga, Cow, and Ram are the matter of faith not of politics; you have to decide their faith by self-determination. It is lack of determination.
- At this moment we are so close to public polls, how do you see that when the people voted for BJP they were full of hope, but after four and half years they feel cheated on the issue Demonetization, Ram temple, GST, Ganga etc.
- People are furious that promises were not kept but they still have faith in PM Modi.
- Do the emotional behavior of people has become a tool for political parties?
- Who had stopped all other parties to talk in right perspective of the issues to the people, the way the main opposition parties like Congress, Mulayam Ji, BSP ignored the issue of Ganga, the way they were busy in number politics not in development politics they paid the price.
- But the question is with the ruling government not to the opposition.
- Yes, I am saying the same thing that they were thrown out of throne because of their irresponsible behavior, you (BJP) cannot cover by saying that they didn’t do the right thing so how we are comparable.
You are responsible because people chose you not them.
- At last, “Party with Difference” was the slogan of BJP. Do you think they had proved them right? Yes, or No.
– Only one thing has happened that hope is still alive in Modi.